My Dual Specs

Patch 3.1.0 is finally here and we now have our Dual Specs. All the Hybrid classes are all excited to be able to swap between Tank/Healer/DPS specs with ease. Just because we can only DPS, doesn’t mean Dual Spec isn’t worth it for us. Now we can bring two different PvE specs to a raid, or even have a PvE and a PvP spec. After messing around with the talent calculators a bit, I came up with two specs I will stick with.

Primary Specialization: PvE/PvP Frost
18/0/53

310-primary-spec

In the Arcane Tree, the main talent you want to pick up is [Torment the Weak] which gives you a 12% damage increase to your Frostbolts on snared targets.

In the 3rd Tier of the Arcane Tree, I chose 3 points of [Student of the Mind] over [Spell Impact] because I will be using the the Molten Armor Glyph over the Ice Lance Glyph. Blizzard still needs to buff Ice Lance more in PvE for me to use it in my rotation.

For the Frost Tree, instead of 3 points into [Frost Channeling] I chose 3 points into [Frostbite] instead. For PvP, Frostbite will come in handy, and threat doesn’t matter.

As for PvE, I was having zero mana problems, and aggro wasn’t a factor when I use my Mirror Images and Invisibility correctly. Plus for trash and some bosses, my 1 point [Improved Blizzard] combined with Frostbite made it very easy. This especially came in handy for the trash during the Razorscale and the XT-002 Deconstructor fights.

I also picked up Deep Freeze for good measure. This spec is more PvE oriented, but is vary capable for PvP. For Arena, I would stick with this spec still but swap out some Glyphs. You know you DON’T have to be at a Lexicon to use your Glyphs anymore right? I love this patch!

Minor Glyphs:

Major Glyphs:

Secondary Specialization: Pure PvE Fire
18/53/0

310-secondary-spec

For the Arcane Tree, I went pretty much the same route as my Primary Spec, but this time instead, I have 3 points [Spell Impact] and 1 point [Student of the Mind] since it will also affect Fireballs.

In the Fire Tree, it is pretty much cookie cutter Fireball. I still picked up 3 points [Improved Scorch] even though I won’t be using the Glyph that goes with it. Because even though I might not have to stack the debuff anymore, I still get the passive 3% Spell Crit to my Fireballs.

This spec is just for raiding purposes for when extra DPS is required. I tried PvPing with this spec pre-3.1.0, and it just makes me angry. I’m thinking about switching to PvE Arcane, or back to PvE Frostfire, but I’m not sure yet. I pretty much picked this spec because it was doing good damage, and it was the last raiding spec I had.

Minor Glyphs:

Major Glyphs:

So far I’m enjoy the Dual Spec feature a lot. The DPS as Frost is decent, but still lacks behind Fire, Frostfire, and Arcane by a good margin. I sometimes surprise myself though with this spec and top the meters.

Right now I’m running with exactly 600 Haste, and my Frostbolts are at around 2.05 second casts. With a Ret Pally or Boomkin, I am at sub 2.0 second casts, with 1.8 second casts when my [Embrace of the Spider] procs. My DPS skyrockets whenever Heroism or Icy Veins is popped, and I’m enjoying ~1.5 second casts.

I needs more Haste!


18 Comments

  1. Valdesta April 16, 2009 4:02 am 

    Awesome post with a huge amount of info!

    I’ve lost track of my Mage’s tree and skills, so I’ll be borrowing your information as a starting point when I finally put enough effort into dinging 80 on him ;)

    In general tho, I’m really enjoying the dual-spec features on my lowbies that are leveling – it’s delightful to put myself in LFG and be able to *properly* heal OR DPS and not have some half-gimped out spec for DPS just so I can heal properly.

    Of course, now I have to learn how to play trees I’ve never fully spec’d into, but that’s a fun challenge too :)

    Valdesta
    WoWGrrl’s player blog

  2. Jose April 16, 2009 10:21 am 

    Hey, I was wondering, how’s your performance as a frost mage in Ulduar?, I mean DPS. Is it good? I want to try it, but my guild is requiring that everyone has to go in the Top DPS spec, because is progress, in this case 18/53/0, etc.

    Greetings.

    PS: srry about my english ^^.

  3. krizzlybear April 16, 2009 2:21 pm 

    I did 18/0/53 PvE primary and 20/0/51PvP secondary. Gonna try me out some arenas/bg’s this time around!!

    krizzlybears last blog post..The World of Lorecraft

  4. Salandor April 20, 2009 3:14 am 

    o lol…. first of all, hi:) second of all i seen some errors in your dual spec info:
    in your pvp frost build glyph – change molten armor to evocation – it the best self healing glyph for arena mages
    and in your secondary fire build i have pretty much the same with one BIG change – loos 2 points in the fire range (35 yards in ok) and put them in student of mind to increase your crit rate from molten armor -

    and i also seen on your screen that u have pretty low haste – for this build hit SP>haste>crit (~500 would be fine ) cause u will cas spell much faster but you will also have big rate for crit from your spiryt/molten armor

  5. Northernmagi April 20, 2009 10:12 am 

    @Tuna

    As one of the notable mages in the wow community, I’d really like to have your view on how mage dps is doing in 3.1.
    We ran an alt naxx run yesterday and ALL of our mages were in the bottom half of the DPS meters (we were constantly top-5 before in 25 mans) on boss fights. Same thing on XT and any other stand-and-dps encounters. Melee beats us BADLY. (we’re currently running with either 20/51/0 or 0/53/18 + fm dual spec exploit).

    Have all mages turned into second rate dps overnight ?

  6. Tuna April 20, 2009 4:08 pm 

    @ Jose

    The DPS is good, but still behind on Fire, Frostfire, and Arcane. If your raid needs “top DPS spec” then you might have to switch to them. But if your raid needs Replenishment, or don’t mind your spec as long as you’re still doing good, then you can stay as Frost. A lot of the bosses have trash, or extra mobs during the fight. They can be slowed, snared, and frozen. As Frost, it makes the trash part of the fight very easy (w/ Imp Blizz + Frostbite).

    @ Salandor

    Yea if I were to bring that spec into Arena, I would definitely swap my Glyphs for Evocation and Ice Barrier. For the Fire spec, I will consider taking the points out. At the time, I wasn’t thinking of the 35 yds range for Fireball/Pyroblast/Living Bomb, but was looking at the 30 yds for Scorch. With the new debuff from Warlocks, or even Frost Mages, keeping up Scorch isn’t a problem anymore.

    I have two sets of gear for my Mage. I have a Haste/Spell Power set for my Frost Spec (600 Haste/ 2050 SP) and regular Spell Power/Crit Set for when I’m Fire spec. You might have caught me in my Fire set.

    @ Northernmagi

    I haven’t ran old content (stuff you already learned) yet, so I can’t tell you how Mages are doing compared to other classes. But for the new Ulduar stuff, you have to take learning into account before you look at the DPS charts. Usually when you’re learning fights, you concentrate more on staying alive rather than DPSing.

    For XT, even though it is a stand-and-dps fight, there are times where ranged will have to move (light bomb, gravity bomb). When we killed XT, all the ranged were clumped together, while the melee where spread out around the boss. Melee didn’t have to move much when they got the bombs, but ranged had to move when we did.

    Also for that fight, we had the Mages on trash duty. DPS the boss isn’t the only job we have.

    Whoops I lied. I just remembered doing Archavon, but the Mages were still on top for me when I did it.

  7. Salandor April 21, 2009 1:04 am 

    @Tuna

    One more question to you, if I may..
    what rly is the diferance between 20/51/0 and 0/53/18 for me it is almost the same builds (yeah a know in arcane is ttw and + for spirit and in frost it is ici vain and frost chaneling) but all in all what is better, i’we just got mine dual spec and taken 53/18 – but never tried it on ulduar i was 20/51 so what is better

    1 or 2 option

    Regards
    Salandor

  8. Tuna April 21, 2009 11:54 am 

    I agree that they are very similar. Both Fireball (20/51/0) and Frostfire (0/53/18) play pretty much exactly the same. Spam main nuke while refreshing Scorch and Living Bomb. Cast Pyroblast on Hot Streak procs.

    The biggest difference I see is that Frostfire spec is a lot more crit dependent and the DPS isn’t as consistent as Fireball. Sometimes you have 6k DPS, sometimes you have 5.5K DPS. Fireball HITS harder, and Frostfire CRITS harder. Fireball also crits more often from my experience.

    Frostfire: 250% Crit Dmg, +21% Damage for Frostfire Bolt, 20% Threat reduction on Frostfire Bolt, +3% Hit, Icy Veins.

    Fireball: 150% Crit Dmg, +31% Damage for Fireball, 10% Threat reduction, +0% Hit, Focus Magic, Combustion.

    It is also easier to gear for Frostfire than Fireball. Since you have not Hit talents for Fireball, you have to make sure you have enough Spell Hit before you can spec that way.

  9. Ancestral April 22, 2009 3:03 am 

    Hey Tuna!

    Thanks for this thread. 1 question.. Who do you have points in toment of the weak ? for raids.. Its kind of rare that bosses are snared or slowed

    Best
    A

  10. Salandor April 22, 2009 3:08 am 

    So basicly in your opinion fire spec is better because if u have not to high crit rate the frostfire dps would be lover i dont have problems with hit cpa – more ever i have to much hit.. and no item to change it:P now i have 399 hit.. – 14,91% and no gems to change… i just must wh8 for better drops :/

  11. Tuna April 22, 2009 3:25 am 

    @ Ancestral

    Yes, Torment the Weak works for raids, even bosses. Not from Frostbolt, or Frostfire Bolt, but from other classes. Off the top of my head, here are some slows, and snares that works on bosses:

    Warrior – Thunderclap
    Arcane Mage – Slow
    Death Knight – Frost Fever
    Prot Pally – Judgment of the Just

    These all work on bosses, and count as a snare/slow for Torment the Weak.

    @ Salandor

    Also Fireball scales better than Frostfire Bolt. Fireball has a 115% Spell Power Coefficient, while Frostfire Bolt has a 100.71% Spell Power Coefficient. Meaning as you get more and more Spell Power, Fireball will benefit from it more.

  12. Salandor April 22, 2009 3:44 am 

    ahh thak you for this quick feetback :) niw i know that i can loos the 0/53/18 and make frost spec instead it will be good both for aoe trash mobs on raid and also for pvp fun :)
    but i have loot of work to do with my gear shame that frost isn’t as good as it was in TBC on raids

  13. Salandor April 22, 2009 5:44 am 

    Tuna one more question for you,

    it was in TBC when i last time played frost nower days what is the roatation?

    spam frostbolt and standard pet+frost bolt +ice lance combo when target is freezed?

  14. Ancestral April 22, 2009 6:24 am 

    Hey again Tuna!

    Thanks for the info… Since all are reseted now Im going to try that specc out.. So you have any special rotation ?

  15. Ancestral April 22, 2009 6:28 am 

    ohh sry btw… why no Arcane PVE specc ?

  16. Ancestral April 22, 2009 6:30 am 

    And ohh my god .. another question.. Why do you choose to use Glyph of Fireball.. Isnt the dmg over time quite high and create really good overall dmg ?

  17. Salandor April 22, 2009 7:02 am 

    @Ancestral

    the rotation is scorch (if u are only mage in raid) living bomb, then spam fireball when hot steak proc cast pyro, ceep up the scorch and living bomb ( but now i dont know if the scorch is needen when u have lock in raid)

    Why no Arcane? – because Ulduar is not arcane frendly, simple the fights are to long, u will be long gone out of mana in the middle of the boss – thats why no arcane.

    u dont need extra dmg from fireball DOT, living bomb, pyro DOT and igniate are good enough for it

    Regards
    Salandor

  18. Ancestral April 22, 2009 7:44 am 

    @ Salandor

    Thanks m8. I guessed is was something like that..

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